First, there was the debate sponsored by MSNBC. I’m not sure what Republicans were thinking, “This is a brilliant idea! Hosted by a network that hates us and with a liberal audience who won’t be voting in Republican primaries!”
Next, there was last night. I think the timing of the debate is best summed up by Jim Geraghty in today’s Morning Jolt:
Well, sure, it was up against the season premiere of Monday Night Football, but at least the early primary states were tuned in. Wait, the New England Patriots were playing, so every football fan in New Hampshire was watching ESPN. Okay, but the debate was taking place in Florida, so at least the Florida Republicans, er, wait, no, the Patriots were playing Miami. Hey, Tea Party Express, what other debate dates were you contemplating? Halloween? Thanksgiving night? Christmas?
And that doesn’t even get into the actual debate itself, most of which we caught.
There was the 30-year-old man debacle in which Ron Paul was asked if a fit, young guy carried no health insurance at all and then got into a bad accident, what should happen to him? No real answer came out, so he was asked outright if the guy should be left to die. And, of course, a brilliant Ronulian decided to scream out that he should, which became the answer everyone focused on for the evening. Stay classy, Paul supporter. You just made your candidate look like a bigger douche. Then, Paul finally said that churches bailed sick people out when he used to practice shortly after the Stone Age. Somehow, I don’t think putting the cost of healthcare on the backs on non-profits is the world’s best plan. Bachmann was then asked to tackle the 30-year-old question and the non-answer turned into screaming about Obamacare. Apparently, no one in the GOP presidential pool can say, “Send him the bill for his care.”
But the really bizarre turn happened when the issue of giving the HPV vaccine that can prevent a form of cancer in women was more controversial than Romney’s version of Obamacare. Bachmann was on a roll with a Jenny McCarthy-type rant against the vaccine, and I’ve seen more than a fair share of social conservatives on Twitter express discomfort with the extremes in her behavior on stage when it came to the HPV issue. Hello? Tea Party audience members who were wildly cheering her on, if you’re so anti-vaccine, why stay calm & let the Romneycare go with a pass? It seemed like the audience’s priorities were a bit out-of-whack.
I just hope that all of this extra coverage & the new opportunities for Republicans to spread the crazy doesn’t result in alienating independents for the eventual nominee.
I thought Huntsman looked pretty good in this debate. Where does he stand on 2A?
Huntsman has no chance. Especially when his idea of trying to identify with people and/or sound hip was a pop culture reference about 20 years too late. I’m not a fan of the “rino hunting” attitude of a lot of people that is really just someone screaming, “You don’t agree with me on an issue, so get out of the GOP!” But, as much as I dislike it, this is the what we can look forward to if he picks up steam.
There was a debate last night?? Football, Phillies and Cam on NRA News was plenty for me!!
I’m a moderate and won’t vote for Perry, Bachmann, Paul or Palin or anyone who is a social conservative. So, where does Huntsman stand on 2A? Does anyone know?
HPV vaccine should not have been mandated, and Perry has admitted that it was wrong to do so.
I don’t quite get the opposition to the HPV vaccine outside of HPV is spread via the secretions below the belt and not the ones above the belt
I don’t quite get the opposition to the HPV vaccine outside of HPV is spread via the secretions below the belt and not the ones above the belt
That’s exactly the reason for the opposition. It’s wrong to thwart the consequences of sin, don’t you know.
Even better than “Send him the bill” is “That’s a State issue”
Perry:
HPV vaccine – wouldn’t even back down and said he’d act first if it meant it might help people. Clearly doesn’t understand the role of government, thinks it’s a big ‘ol nanny.
Romney:
Romneycare. ‘Nuff said. Magic underwear don’t help either.
Huntsman:
Believes in Al Gore’s other invention, Global Warming. They used to be even more afraid of Global Cooling:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ndHwW8psR8
Santorum:
Religious nutjob who thinks it’s the role of government to tell me how to live. Sorry, that’s what I can’t stand about the left.
Cain:
This guy is clearly only invited for comic relief.
Bachmann:
Makes Sarah Palin look like a genius.
Paul:
Probably the one I like the most out of this bunch, but completely unelectable. He sees long term possibilities as short term goals (ie, get rid of Dept of Education). In the real world, it’s completely unrealistic, and why more people don’t take him seriously.
Gingrich:
I like some of the things he says, but it seems he’ll say anything to be elected. Although it also seems like he doesn’t expect he has a chance anymore and is just trying to help frame the debate.
Gary Johnson:
I’m disappointed that he’s not involved in these debates, as I think he’d be my first choice. I’m surprised that the Tea Party Express, of all people, didn’t have him in their debate. Not sure how to read that.
It really would be nice to have a candidate that didn’t suck for once. if the federal government wasn’t so all-encompassing, it wouldn’t matter as much. I think that’s part of the reason we’re constantly disappointed by whoever runs or is elected. No one person will ever be perfect for 300 million people. State elections should be more important, but we’re constantly trying to keep the federal government at bay. It seems that presidential elections are mostly about containment and damage control anymore.
Sebastion, why do you suppose it was a Paul supporter that yelled “let him die?”
It is inconsistant with what I understand is his stance, and it’s obvious by later answers that this was not exactly a venue stocked with Paul supporters.
From what I understand, Tea Party Express is co-opted by the current republican party. I am on iPad so not the greatest tool for cross researching so forgive me.
Btw, as a Paul supporter I wouldn’t yell out “let him die” but I would if asked offer that current healthcare costs are a result of a system where healthcare service contracts are being sold as insurance. If you have an auto service\maintenance contract you don’t care what the price of labor is, or how badly the mechanic gouges you for parts because you are not the one paying the bill.
Insurance is for catastrophic health issues where you could not expect to pay due to the nature of the issue. It is not for oil changes.
When I was unemployed I went to my doctor for help with a sinus infection. He would have billed my insurance if I had it $125 because that was the rate negotiated by the plan, state etc. I self paid $55 and got $3 antibiotics and was healthy in a week.
If it got bad and I had to pay $500 and then $1,000 antibiotic treatments or hospital stay, THAT is what insurance should be for. (if I set my deductibles properly).
That is specifically the stance recommended by Paul in several books and talks I have heard. That is hardly “let him die”
chiburbian:
This is Bitter’s post, not mine… but it’s a well known fact that Ron Paul hates children, and practices witchcraft. This is undeniable.
@Mike – thats pretty spot on. Once again the GOP gives voters a choice between a douche and a turd sandwich. Perry and Bachmann are clearly unelectable and have the GOP establishment scared of Obamas second term.
@chiburban. $1000 for a hospital stay? Try closer to $100,000 if you end up in the ICU or get cancer.
“I’m a moderate and won’t vote for Perry, Bachmann, Paul or Palin or anyone who is a social conservative. ”
Paul wants to let states vote on legalizing drugs, but he’s a social conservative?
And let’s get something straight about Ron Paul’s health question answer. When Wolf asked him if the guy should die, Paul said, “No.”
As for the Dept. of Education, getting rid of that was a big Republican thing not very long ago. For some reason, now they only tend to go after things like NPR.
Here’s a great article on Ron Paul. http://www.tommullen.net/featured/what-are-they-afraid-of/
“He puts conservatives to shame for their hypocrisy about “free markets†and “small government,†while doing the same to liberals for their hypocrisy about “ending foreign wars†and “protecting civil liberties.†“
Just to chime in on here….
Regarding the HPV vaccine. The issue here is mandates. And it causes a lot more headaches than you might imagine. If you don’t have children, you don’t understand the issue.
We recently planned on enrolling our children into a pre-school. My wife had our kids all ready with there lunchboxes.They were unable to attend. The reason being an issue with vaccinations.
Now it’s not that my wife and I are against vaccines. Our kids have most of them. However, we did not want to get the Hep B.
We understand the need for vaccines for infectious diseases in social settings like schools (smallpox, measles, etc). These are diseases that are rapidly spread from child to child.
Hep B is not. It is NOT a contagious infectious disease. It’s basically transferred in a similar fashion as HIV – via bodily fluids. There are very few cases of Hep B infection under age 14. And of those, nearly all fall into one of two categories. Infants born to infected mothers who are infected at birth. And those closer to age 14 who have become sexually active or used drugs.
The risk to 2-10 year olds is almost non-existent. That said, there have been some concerns regarding this vaccine. Furthermore, while there have been studies that have shown vaccines safe. These do not take into account manufacturing defects. I worked for a company that was one of the leading manufacturers of chemical testing standards. We ran through a battery of quality control tests. Every now and then a batch would make it out that had failed. I believe that most of the problems that have occurred in relation to vaccines have one of two causes:
a) given an undeveloped immune system 4-6 nasty viruses to deal with at a single inoculation
b) bad manufacturing lots, and when you’re making millions, it’s basically a given some will be subpar
However, thanks to Pennsylvania’s mandatory vaccination laws which now includes mandates for non-infectious diseases. Our children have been unable to attend pre-school. Mind you, this is a private religious school. But PA pretty much mandates this policy for all schools.
And this is WRONG!!!
I’ve had a trip or 2 to the hospital and here’s one thing you want to notice. When I was billed there was the hospital’s rate and the rate they negotiated with my insurance company. If you don’t have insurance they will bill you at a higher rate.
Yes the correct answer is bill the patient. He will possibly negotiate his bill and pay using his health savings account.
Cancer is one of the terrible things that can wipe out your life savings even if you have insurance. We don’t like to think about limits on our health care. It is a fact of life. I need food, clothing, housing. I’d like to have some comforts and leisure. We can’t devote unlimited resources to health care without degrading our total quality of life.
Wait, I cannot fathom it being so strighatfroward.
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